dsl135 Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 Go ahead and check out this thread over on the Yahoo Fantasy Hockey message boards. http://sports.yahoo.com/fantasy/message-boards/?&bn=4fe89797-63d1-3b3d-a98d-37871fabd891&tid=1427069247712-8da42fbc-2d1f-495d-a33f-ecc423f248d3&tls=la%2Cd%2C0%2C3 Point and laugh at the idiot trying to tell me I'm the wrong one and that there's no way to tell the differences. I especially love the "as long as you're fine with gambling on size and find a reputable seller, they're exactly the same". What a moron! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 (edited) That link didn't take me to that, it went to their general page. Maybe I need an account to see it? Edited March 27, 2015 by mfitz804 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richardmanuel Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 (edited) Pro-counterfeiters always are sure to Call it "a shirt" Exaggerate the price ($300 is always the cheapest legitimate jersey available) Act as if it's their right to own a jersey I understand why people buy them, I honestly don't care if they do, but don't make up all this crap for your argument. You're just a cheap ######, simple as that. Also I really want that guy to post pictures so he'll eat his own words. Edited March 27, 2015 by richardmanuel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 Not having read it, I can say this. If you really don't care about jerseys, and you buy ONE counterfeit and wear it to games and such, fine, whatever. Aside from the illegalities, I could really care less if someone does that. But, to call yourself a "collector" and to build a collection of fakes makes zero sense. A pile of crap is still a pile of crap, no matter how much you add to it, it's still just a bigger pile of crap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsl135 Posted March 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 Haha, I knew I'd get the justification required here. I kinda want him to post the pictures too. I'm sure it would be easy to tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngeloS76 Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 What that poster doesn't realize is that the $300 shirt that one gets from Reebok isn't a $15 shirt like the ones they buy from Ali Express, they're $150 shirts made in Canada by people who aren't exploited for their labor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dsl135 Posted March 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 What that poster doesn't realize is that the $300 shirt that one gets from Reebok isn't a $15 shirt like the ones they buy from Ali Express, they're $150 shirts made in Canada by people who aren't exploited for their labor. Yup! Love how he thinks he's so knowledgable, yet he doesn't know that the true authentic jerseys he's talking about are made in Canada, not "the same factory, under the same conditions." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongDistanceHeart Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 'They're all made in the same factory in China!' This one pisses me off to no end. When's the last time Reebok made NHL jerseys in China? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilsguy Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 I belong on several Devils FB fan groups and this is brought up on a weekly basis in there. When someone asks for a recommendation for a good site to buy jerseys that are not a rip off like NHL.com or the team store, some idiot always recommends Aliexpress or one of the galaxy of websites that sell counterfeit jerseys. The most common thing they say is "the quality is as-good, if not better than the premiers" and "you won't tell the difference at all!" Well either they are blind or just don't care about the quality but I find both of those statements to be laughable and a way to rationalize their counterfeit jerseys. I've actually seen people brag about how they have a 70-100 jersey collection and when they post pics of it, most if not all are the $30 fakes. A lot of these will also argue that the replicas that cost $150-200 (if anyone pays that much for a customized replica then they are doing it wrong) are made in the same factories as the $30 knockoffs. Obviously they are not as the quality is much different and if they were in the same factory they would have access to the same materials and equipment. I also tell them that if they are so worried about the conditions of the Reebok factories in Asia then they could only imagine how terrible the conditions must be in the factories controlled by Chinese gangsters making the counterfeits. In the end these "collectors" are pretty much starting to be the norm now and unfortunately that's the way it is. People will always flock to it because of the price. Hell these websites are now selling those vintage looking player sweaters/hoodies for $40 when the real things cost $80. Yup they are counterfeiting stuff that are normally under $100. This is just how cheap/stupid more and more fans are becoming to save a few dollars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 And then the rest of us wear a legit replica (as I am right now), and we get upset that we couldn't find it in a more expensive authentic version, which we would have gladly paid for if it were available. To answer your question, Colorado Rockies Chico Resch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
likeaboss2 Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 At the end of the day, i cant feel morally right with myself buying fake anything. Its amazing that fake sports merchandise has become so acceptable. Part of the problem is that authentics arent even available for those who want to spend the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecapn Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 I don't have any moral problems with it personally. Yes, it's wrong, I agree, of course, but I wouldn't feel my conscience acting up. But they're just so OBVIOUSLY BAD. I have yet to see a fake that looks as good as a real one. Even before I got into jerseys I could spot them a mile away. If you could wear a fake, and it was exactly identical, and no one would ever know, then I might understand. But why would you want to wear something that looks so horrible, that people can spot a mile away? It's like you're wearing a gigantic arrow over your head pointing down, saying "I'm too cheap to buy a real replica." No thanks. And the more people do it, the harder it is for those of us who want good ones to get them. It's simple supply and demand - the less demand for real jerseys, the less they'll make, and the more they'll cost to produce per jersey. Ugh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
architecht13 Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 I enjoy buying authentic jerseys, but can understand why people don't. Instead of going on about the pricing and how the NHL and Reebok screw the fans, I will just say that the feeling I get when that jersey gets to my mailbox all customised is just unbelievable. Sure, the process in finding/buying/customising is a blast, but man, the feeling of putting that Jersey on for the fist time makes me smile every time. I don't have the means to buy as many as I like, but each of the jerseys I own have stories in them: My 2000 CCM Belfour (Home) went with me to game 2 of the Stanley Cup Finals in New Jersey where the Stars won and I almost got into a fist fight with the guy behind me. My 2000 CCM Hatcher (Home) went with me when I saw the Stars play the Rangers late in the following season. Matvichuk almost hit me in the head with a puck during the pre game and later in the game, a Ranger fan asked me how I would like ketchup on my jersey. I told him that would be fine as long as he would like blood on his. My 2013 Reebok Lehtonen (Home) was a gift from my current girlfriend who listened to me rattle off hockey stuff for a year and ordered as a surprise. It has been with me to the Phoenix game this year when the Stars beat the Coyotes and the two of us went nuts when we had Tim Bits for the first time. There are a few others that are waiting on customisation and I can't wait to see what stories will unfold with them. Sorry for the cheesy post - it's still early and my cynical side hasn't woken up yet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 But, just because WE like the feeling of receiving an authentic, it doesn't mean everyone does. Some people don't care about the quality or the morality. I disagree with them but at the end of the day, their business is their business, not mine. I don't care who has a crappy jersey, I care that I don't. I also agree that both the current price and availability of today's Authentics is part of the problem. How pervasive was the problem when you could get a properly customized on-ice jersey for $200? If one were to pay full price today (granted nobody should), it's well over $400. Not saying that would eliminate fakes, but there have to be at least some people for whom $200 would be acceptable but over $400 isn't. Again, that's not people like us. I'm talking about normal people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 To each their own. I have a hard time understanding how someone could buy multiple fakes as the person in the Yahoo thread indicated. For me, I want the assurance that the jersey is high quality. I want them to be durable enough to wear without the worry about excessive pilling or runs. For that reason alone I won't ever entertain the thought of a knockoff. Ultimately I do agree. He obviously likes jerseys enough to build a collection, and it makes no sense to collect fakes. One or two just to wear around, I can see the logic. For me, the hunt for what I want at a better than normal price is part of what I enjoy about the hobby. I could pick out jerseys on MeiGray all day for $300-1000. But it's much more gratifying to grab one off this site or on eBay for $150. Have there been jerseys I paid full price for? Sure. But finding those diamonds in a heap of turds is always great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khabbi Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 I find the Chinese replicas in Tampa to be especially bad... or maybe they are just that bad everywhere? Wrong looking numbers, colors (there are some chinese ones that are brighter blue that look ridiculous), bad logo execution (the sharp lightning bolt logo seems to be a problem to chinese factories). Of course some of the people that have them claim they are "authentic and better" than the Lightning sold Premier's because they may have a fight strap (lol). There seems to be an especially large number of the old blue Lightning 3rd "bolts" fake jerseys running around here. These jerseys might as well have a giant sign on them that says "fake!" on them. I've had a few people comment about my authentic Jerseys, and it certainly makes you feel good that someone knows the true quality of an authentic and can point one out. But I think most people just don't care and couldn't tell you the difference.. and I've often wondered how many people could really tell an authentic from a premier or even a fake. And I do believe that some would look at an authentic and think it was fake because it looks different than a premier (especially in Tampa, where all of the premiers have a horrible, giant iron-on main lightning logo). The authentics have stitched Lightning main logos, and the fakes are all stitched also, so there is one thing the chinese are doing that may draw a fan to their jersey (knowingly or not). And it kind of makes you wonder if some do go for the fakes since the premiers are so blatantly bad with the main logo. To each his own. Some certainly don't get my obsession with authentic/game worn jerseys and are happy with their replicas and think I'm nuts for spending the money for an authentic. To them, it's all about having a representation of the team and they don't care how much different it is from what's being worn on the ice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecapn Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 I also agree that both the current price and availability of today's Authentics is part of the problem. How pervasive was the problem when you could get a properly customized on-ice jersey for $200? If one were to pay full price today (granted nobody should), it's well over $400. Not saying that would eliminate fakes, but there have to be at least some people for whom $200 would be acceptable but over $400 isn't. Hope you don't mind that I edited this The cynic in me tells me I'm wrong, but to me, this is a chicken and the egg situation. Anything costs less when it's produced in higher quantities. The raw materials can usually be gotten at a discount. If you're buying a machine to make 1,000 jerseys, than the per-jersey cost is less than if you're only making 100. I'm sure there's plenty of other examples that could be given. The high and easy availability of fakes means less people buying jerseys (even replicas). That means less demand, and SHOULD mean less jerseys produced. And that means the per-jersey cost goes up. So the cost of Authentics goes up even higher. Smart business might be to lower cost to increase demand - that does happen, of course. It hasn't yet! More people buy fakes, prices go higher. Unfortunately, I see this getting worse, not better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Hope you don't mind that I edited this The cynic in me tells me I'm wrong, but to me, this is a chicken and the egg situation. Anything costs less when it's produced in higher quantities. The raw materials can usually be gotten at a discount. If you're buying a machine to make 1,000 jerseys, than the per-jersey cost is less than if you're only making 100. I'm sure there's plenty of other examples that could be given. The high and easy availability of fakes means less people buying jerseys (even replicas). That means less demand, and SHOULD mean less jerseys produced. And that means the per-jersey cost goes up. So the cost of Authentics goes up even higher. Smart business might be to lower cost to increase demand - that does happen, of course. It hasn't yet! More people buy fakes, prices go higher. Unfortunately, I see this getting worse, not better. But, the price was significantly increased at the time of the introduction of the EDGE jersey. The fakes are mostly EDGE from what I have seen. So the chicken/egg thing doesn't really apply, the real EDGE, and their increased price, obviously had to come before the fake EDGE. So the availability of fakes didn't affect the price of the legit jerseys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scarchelli Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 I challenged him to take some pics of his BS. Money says he doesn't post s***. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MeccaDon123 Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 Some of you know how I was introduced to "fakes" vs. authentics, and what happened to me will always be my issue with the topic. If a person wants to own a fake on purpose, ok whatever. If a person (like me) walks into a huge sports memorabilia store in the local mall and buys his 1st signed jersey for $250 bucks THAT TURNS OUT TO BE A $20 CHINESE KNOCKOFF with a legit JSA certified sig on it that is the main issue as far as I'm concerned. Owning an entire freaking store full of fakes and passing them off as real to unknowing people, I thought was against the law. On top of selling fakes you host signings at your store where star players and alumni show up for signings...where if you don't bring your own item to be signed, THEY ARE SIGNING A PILE FULL OF FAKES. The "collector" mentioned above will always try to find a way to justify what he's doing so he can feel good about it. I think a lot of what he's saying re: fake vs auth. translates over from the "replica sneaker market". That is a huge business right now, bigger than all sports jerseys combined. And unlike jerseys, the REAL sneakers are made in sweatshops and the fakes are made by a small group of people who work in better conditions than the folks that make the auth. sneakers. And there are people who seek the "replicas" out, and a lot of sellers who actually sell replicas as replicas vs. passing them off as fakes. If you don't have the money and you feel good about your fakes, more power to ya. But when you start trying to pass your fakes off as "equal to, or just as good as the OG's", that becomes the problem. The minute you do that you're helping the fake market gain traction, but not nearly as much as a store owner in the mall passing an entire store full of fakes...who also uses the exact same pathetic argument: "Real jerseys cost too much and everyday people can't afford them in todays economy" (his exact words to me). Well mr. store full of fakes your argument immediately collapses on itself when you sell a $20 knock-off for $250 bucks ya clown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
architecht13 Posted April 1, 2015 Report Share Posted April 1, 2015 So much win, I can't even quote it all! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orangecrush139 Posted April 3, 2015 Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 (edited) The guy's Yahoo account was deactivated in the days since his posts. Pretty much tells you all you need to know. I've got no issue whatsoever with people buying fakes. That's their prerogative. The NHL seems to release reports each year setting new record after new record in merchandising sales, so they're doing just fine. I know counterfeits are a widespread problem. Back in 2011 before the official 2012 WC was announced, someone leaked a fake image of the Flyers modeling a WC jersey based off the old Quakers wordmark in a black and orange striped jersey......you should have seen how many people bought counterfeits and wore them to the games before the officials were unveiled. That was one of the funnier egg-on-your-face moments I've ever seen in regards to fakes. But the funnier part with the guy claiming that there is no noticeable difference to the naked eye is just wrong haha. Buy the counterfeits if it makes you happy, that's fine lol, but don't get on a high horse and blatantly lie to people who know you're lying! Edited April 3, 2015 by orangecrush139 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lhg39 Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 I got into an argument with someone in the NY Rangers facebook group the other day regarding the knockoffs. It seems that just about everyone in that group is a fan of aliexpress. It is a good group for following the team, but from a jersey perspective, blech. They even have viewing parties where group leaders raffle off knockoff jerseys. If you try to say anything, they give all of the excuses mentioned in the above posts, and they accuse legit sites of selling the same knockoffs since they occasionally have sales! It is unbelievable how people will delude themselves to save a few bucks. I am amazed that Reebok cannot get aliexpress and these other huge selling sites shut down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilsguy Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 Yup see the exact same thing on the Devils FB groups too. I can imagine a lot of FB groups are like that with other teams as well. I think Aliexpress is basically a marketplace and there are different sellers on there that sell knockoffs. I have seen posters post about sellers who do good work and tell others to stay clear of other sellers whose knockoffs are of even poorer quality. They all look terrible to me but to the masses a shirt is a shirt. I think this is why Reebok has had trouble shutting down that site and I think it is a part of Alibaba which is another internet giant. They can go after the sellers but when they shut down one two would take its place the same day. I've seen plenty of knockoff jerseys being used as "prizes" of raffles at viewing parties. It is what it is unfortunately and as long as the raffle tickets are free for that piece of garbage then I really do not get worked up over it. What is worse to me is the countless signed fakes that are framed and being sold for huge amounts at Sports Collectable stores and shows that I see all the time. These are dealers and they know they are trying to sell a framed $30 fake for $500. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TMLFAN Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 This issue comes up from time to time on a card collecting forum I'm on. I laugh because a lot of those guys are all over the counterfeits justifying them the same way as already stated in this thread. Patch switching is big in the trading card community so these guys are cool buying crappy fake jerseys but then get all up in arms when they catch someone trying to sell a altered patch card claiming it's fake. Idiots Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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